ZEQ2 Lite

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

The time has come.

I always wondered how Buksna can heal up that fast when I fight him... and here was the answer, something dang`ed in my mind about the tier thingie that anyone can modify, it`s not that hard at all.

First of all, I want to show this to all because I`ve found it this morning and I WANT EVERYONE TO SEE IT.

This works just on the host-server :

- Modify the default tier file by opening it with a text document. (you can modify values by will)

- Copy the tier file to Goku folder, so you can have a new tier file. (Goku > tier)

- restore the old default tire file so just that Goku has modified tier.

- Make another copy of player Goku and there are 2 gokus now.

- Rename one Goku into GOKUU

- Let that GOKUU with edited tire file and the other normal Goku with normal tire file

- Make a server and use GOKUU

You will have edited skills with normal character (no addons) on your server. Now you can be in the top fighter list and everyone will want to be powerful as you.

I created this thread for all to know that Public Beta 1 is hackable on the server host and some players here I`m sure they already used it.

Shame on you Buksna, I saw you heal faster than normal on your server and you told me last time we fought ''you can`t beat me''. You were right. I couldn`t beat you, but not because you are very good but because you are just a very good bugger.

I can`t hold dirty things like this for me. Shame for everyone that used it. I have honor and I want to play fair.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Buksna....................ah

how could you
how could you

you you cheater.....ahhhhh
no no this can't be

Buksna you were my hero
I looked up to you not domitjen

and now you screwed us all

thanks a million for the ZEQ2 experience
I am heart broken

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

This is not a bug at all, neither a cheat.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Well technically it is cheating. It's similar to using bright skins, wall hacking or aim bots.

It's easy to prevent though, unfortunately for some reason ZEQ2 Lite isn't using pk3 files and pure servers which were specifically introduced to Quake 3 because of this (plus the added bonus of making addon characters easier to distribute by just copying / deleting pk3 files from a directory).

As it stands right now every programmer with a tiny bit of knowledge can modify the cgame.qvm to code a bot that automatically dodges and fights too.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

I'm sure Buksna will confess if this indeed is the case.

But to be honest I'm sceptical whether or not he has done this.
You've accused me of cheating and sometimes thinking other players of being me and calling them cheaters too.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Hmmmm

Jaguar you got something wrong...so let me explain it...

When you play on addon servers - even if you don't have addons your character will be as much as powerful as one of someone who's using addons - difference will be only in attacks you don't have so you won't be able see them - everything else will be the same

So...if I did modify something about healing - when you join my server you will have it too - so no difference will be there - BUT I didn't

Another thing - I play this game for joy and you can slice my hands if I EVER DID SOME MODIFICATIONS considering characters skills

I NEVER did and NEVER will do anything on that base

You got to this conclusion only because I/You/All of us are using some bugs - but all those bugs I reported imediatly so I can't cheat...every bug I reported I even reported how to defend against it

About healing - healing rate depends on how much stamina you have - every good player should know that - so if your stamina is at half (not blue stamina...I'm talking about gray one) you're going to heal slower...well you'll going to heal fast to that point, and after that its going to go slow <-- that's not cheating..that move is basic one and determines you from uninformed participator to little experienced player - shame on you for not knowing that

And thanks for calling me a cheater

don't try to attack me with some intellectually lacking arguments only because you still aren't better then me/can't beat me

And I've watched you fight too - even if you are 3rd best players I spot so many flaws while you were fighting - usually the basic ones...perhaps you got too much into game so you don't pay attention to your bar

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

RealDeal wrote : Buksna....................ah

how could you
how could you

you you cheater.....ahhhhh
no no this can't be

Buksna you were my hero
I looked up to you not domitjen

and now you screwed us all

thanks a million for the ZEQ2 experience
I am heart broken

thanks a lot realdeal:p

Buksna's healing explanation is 100% correct. Also, I believe and I'm sure that Buksna always plays fair ( yes he used to use a lot of bugs, but we all knew them , so if we don't find a way to avoid or reverse them, then we are the ones who are lacking skills ). But Buksna spending his time with modifiying his tiers to get a better healing result, just sounds absolutely ridiculous to me. Buksna is a fair and pro fighter, Who knows almost everything about the game and uses his knowledge in the fight. But cheating or hacking is not something he would do.

domitjen wrote : Buksna's healing explanation is 100% correct. Also, I believe and I'm sure that Buksna always plays fair ( yes he used to use a lot of bugs, but we all knew them , so if we don't find a way to avoid or reverse them, then we are the ones who are lacking skills ). But Buksna spending his time with modifiying his tiers to get a better healing result, just sounds absolutely ridiculous to me. Buksna is a fair and pro fighter, Who knows almost everything about the game and uses his knowledge in the fight. But cheating or hacking is not something he would do.

I just had a revelation:

I used to fight for the cheer of pleasure for it. For the thrill for the hunt or to have the strength to measure
I spared no one.

And yet, you showed mercy to everyone, even your fearsomes enemys ( soulz, jingoku :p) even..nah not me:p

yet you never fought to kill, or for revenge, only to test your limits and to push yourself beyond them
To become the strongest you could possibly be.. How could a ZEQ2 lite player fight like that. and at the same time be so gentle
that he wouldn't hurt a fly.. It makes me angry just thinking about it. But perhaps it is my anger that has made me blind for the truth until now.

I see it, this day made it all clear.


You're almost the best Buksna..You're number 1,0000001



thaha:p

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Buksna wrote : When you play on addon servers - even if you don't have addons your character will be as much as powerful as one of someone who's using addons - difference will be only in attacks you don't have so you won't be able see them - everything else will be the same

Actually he said you created a new character called gokuu which should by Quake 3 rules fallback to any other character data with at least part of the name in it for other players.

I have some trouble explaining it but I hope you'll understand it simplified:
- Consider a situation where a character "Goku" exists. This character consists of a model file M and attack data A.
- On an unpure server (which is every ZEQ2 Lite server unfortunately) it is possible to create a "child" character "gokuu" inheriting all of "Goku"'s data unless overwritten by new data in the "gokuu" folder. This works by Quake 3 automatically searching for a similar name when "gokuu" isn't found, since "Goku" has 4 of 5 letters in it it's a hit.
- What he said you did in this case is replace the attack data A, but (at least not necessarily) the model data M.

This way players using the "gokuu" model would still show up as "Goku" for themselves but use the increased attack power of "gokuu". Other people who do not have the "gokuu" model will NOT have increased power and not be able to select the "gokuu" character at all and instead work with the data found in the "Goku" directory on client-side (which means displaying "Goku"'s model data M and neither your own "Goku"'s or "gokuu"'s). Since attacks are calculated on server side attack data A of "gokuu" will only be confirmed there, so everyone opening a server can exploit this and use it to cheat.


Other ways of cheating would like I said potentially include replacing the cgame.qvm adding aim bot or wall hack code, replacing the engine's executable (with the same result as a cgame.qvm replacement) or just modifying afforementioned model data M.

Consider for example replacing all model files with a shiny glowing red box exactly measuring up to the bounding box of quake 3 with a big green arrow above the top. That'd make aiming a thousand times easier for yourself while other people would have a lot of trouble firing at krillin for example who's a smaller target than his own bounding box.

In this case you wouldn't even need to be the host of the server.


Why do I keep mentioning pure servers?
A pure server checks the server's pk3 files versus each client. It makes sure the same files exist for everyone as such a custom cgame.qvm would get ignored, while the case of a server side "gokuu" character would be solved by forcing each client to download the "gokuu" character and thus making it available for everyone.


Also just to clarify:
I'm not saying you actually did this, but he brought up a valid concern about a potential exploit which can be easily taken care of by using pk3 files and sv_pure 1.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Thehe dom - NICEEEE!!!

Void: okay I understand - but if that is possible then error on every other computer will be shown like "could not read model gokuu" - I get this usually when someone is using Gohan, Bardock.... <-- so same would appear if that modification gokuu will be selected...and HE should see it - but he didn't

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Not necessarily.

Example:
"Gokuboo" would find a match in "Goku".
"Gohan" on the other hand cannot find a match for "Goha", "Goh", "Go", or "G" and thus ends in an error.

It's of course possible that the first case would also display an error, but the fact that Gohan and Bardock do is a different situation.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

hmmm...just remembered

maybe your theory works with tb but I remember that when someone used "gokun" (he's some addon character that has all transformations) I got that error...

Well anyway...I didn't use it so it were fair battles

EDIT: Can all those modifications be valid if you join another one's server - so if I example create such a character and join someones server - can it happen...I know it can't be done with whole addon characters but if your theory is somehow right it will find it as "Goku" and maybe use it as stronger one - don't know if I explained it clearly

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

No, you can only exploit this when you are hosting the server yourself, not by joining another.

When you join someone elses server your game.qvm is never read, as such all files dealing with it (like .phys files) are ignored too.

Basically clients are at the mercy of the server which has full control over the game, except for visuals and the commands you enter.

As such the biggest potential for abuse will always lie with the server's host so "serious matches" should be played on all-neutral servers or you pack everything up into a pk3 file and enable sv_pure 1, this way every client at least has the same data available and will at least be able to use the cheat himself.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Wouldn't a fight clarify this?If Buksna can beat Jaguar on a fair fight than he's not guilty,I'm just saying...I don't know for sure if Buksna did or did not do this so I won't make false accusations

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Buksna don`t play the silly card. You know you used it, dokumas and me saw you doing it.

Azurite, that`s not the case, that`s just another subject.

Of course there is no solid proof that you used it, but my intuition tells all. I`m sorry for calling you a bugger, but you are.

If you think you are way better then me, prove it. Not on your server, on others server where you can`t modify your skills.

@realdeal : read what void said, anyone can hack with another character on his host server.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

well one thing is der these bugs and cheats should be taken care of and disabled

or at least server security should be increased
I mean the cheat checker or something

and sorry for the nonsense Buksna
I know I am acting like a ill-mannered buffoon

you're still my hero
please forgive me man

I know there's no proof against you of modifying files

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

jaguar wrote : Buksna don`t play the silly card. You know you used it, dokumas and me saw you doing it.

Azurite, that`s not the case, that`s just another subject.

I really don't know what you are talking about - I heal normally...as I remember he did say I heal so fast...but I heal all the time so every hit you give me I automatically heal it...no other explanation

as "Brolly" said it - let me create a server and put "sv_pure 1" command or let someone create his server (like azurite's right now) and fight there - you'll see that I don't cheat and that I'll beat you again, and again and again...

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Buksna wrote :

jaguar wrote : Buksna don`t play the silly card. You know you used it, dokumas and me saw you doing it.

Azurite, that`s not the case, that`s just another subject.

I really don't know what you are talking about - I heal normally...as I remember he did say I heal so fast...but I heal all the time so every hit you give me I automatically heal it...no other explanation

as "Brolly" said it - let me create a server and put "sv_pure 1" command or let someone create his server (like azurite's right now) and fight there - you'll see that I don't cheat and that I'll beat you again, and again and again...

That`s nonesense, I`ve beaten you too much times and last time you beaten me because of that hack. This is not a discussion about rankings, you know that you won`t heal again that faster, it`s just a matter of using that character or not.

And yes, you used that. I`m not the only person that saw you healing too fast. Don`t play the silly card because it doesn`t work here.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Buksna wrote : as "Brolly" said it - let me create a server and put "sv_pure 1" command or let someone create his server (like azurite's right now) and fight there - you'll see that I don't cheat and that I'll beat you again, and again and again...

And make a demo of it so no one can make false accusations afterwards or else this will never end.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Well, dokumas can tell. I saw that too long ago and asked Brad about it, I thought it was jut my mind.

Then dokumas saw that too, well, that`s something, trust me. How can I make a vid now ? he won`t use that again.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

Well of course that he won't use it again that's the entire point to see if he can beat you fair if yes than he didn't use hacks.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

broly3110 wrote : Well of course that he won't use it again that's the entire point to see if he can beat you fair if yes than he didn't use hacks.

No, that won`t prove even a small thing.

This thread it`s about a bug not about a fight, and I`m free to fight any time on someone else`s server. Why not ?

@domitjen : why you really believe that ? that`s just an opinion, that`s nothing to believe just because you believe like that. Of course Buksna is good but he is a bugger. A player that plays fair is not bugging, I spectated you showing each other bugs, that is honorless.

So then, don`t talk about who`s the best or not, think again about it brother.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

jag why would I use it when I already hit the top - noone is there anymore to beat and noone can beat me - its just lacking now for me to use it

Think man think - and you asked dokumas who is GOOD but he's new to all this - he doesn't know anything yet...

Really disappointed to see you trying to exuse yourself from loosing

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

You won't be able to use sv_pure 1 because ZEQ2 Lite isn't distributed in pk3 files. You could create them yourselves, but unless you upload your pk3 somewhere it'll be troublesome to get them synchronized.

Someone using the windows zip tool might get different results from someone using winzip due to slight differences in compression level etc.

The best solution would be to distribute official releases with pk3s while keeping individual files for SVN/developers/contributors.

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

okay - I tried to explain but seems you won't listen

then get used to playing vs bugger and cheater

Wednesday, June 09, 2010

@Buksna : again playing the silly card huh ? it`s not about who`s better. I`ve beaten you, you`ve beaten me.

Last time we fought, dokumas said : Buksna IS HEALING HILARIOUS FAST. I saw that long ago too and ignored it, well, that`s enought for me to believe that you edited your skills. Dokumas it`s not a beginner, he plays for 4 months. Think about it. Now please move along and get on topic, I just wanted to show everyone that this game can be hacked.

That`s all.