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Who is the true Legendary Super Saiyan? Goku or Brolly?

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Son_Gohan1470 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Monday, August 02, 2010

Goku is the first to achieve the Super Saiyan form after witnessing Krillin's murder at the hands of Frieza.

The ability to become a Super Saiyan was once considered to be nothing but a mere legend, because it had not been performed for over one-thousand years (three-thousand in the English dub). However, this legend was proven to be true when Goku accomplished the feat during the titanic battle against the evil tyrant Frieza on the Planet Namek. Despite only being told through legend, Frieza, considered to be the strongest being of his time, became paranoid over the possibility of truth behind the legend of the Super Saiyan, as evidenced by the constantly growing power of the Saiyan race. Because of this fear, Frieza drew the conclusion to annihilate the Saiyan race by destroying Planet Vegeta (although eight Saiyans were established in the manga and anime to have survived the genocide: Goku, Vegeta, Brolly, Paragus, Nappa, Raditz, Tarble and Turles, four of which are non-manga and thus appear in the anime specials or movies only), thus sparking the end of the Super Saiyan legend.

According to Goku (in the FUNimation dub), the Super Saiyan transformation comes in response to a need, not a desire.[1] In all known cases, the form has been initially triggered by either desperation or indignation. Any other conditions are unknown, and motivation tends to differ; for example, Goku achieves the form out of anger over the murder of his best-friend, Krillin, and Vegeta achieves the form through sheer frustration at his original inability to achieve it, especially over Goku. Saiyan hybrids are naturally skilled at this, as they have the emotion of Humans (full blooded Saiyans tend to suppress their feelings) with the fighting potential of Saiyans. As the Saiyans train during Dragon Ball Z, they discover uncharted levels beyond the first Super Saiyan level. The appearance of a Super Saiyan is different in each form, more so in the fourth and final form to the point where the original transformation has since been literally reduced to that of a "child's play thing" (says Vegeta after witnessing Trunks transform and harness the power adeptly at such a young age).

In the main series, all living Saiyan-blooded males following the Frieza Saga manage to reach at least the first level of Super Saiyan. No female Super Saiyans are ever seen, however the Dragon Ball GT Perfect Files implies that Pan has the potential to transform and might have become a type of Super Saiyan never seen before.
edit Overview
The Saiyan transformation tree.

The first Super Saiyan transformation occurs when a Saiyan who has reached a very high level of power, has a calm, pure heart (good or evil), and loses himself in a fit of rage. However, the transformation must be triggered in response to a great need, example being in Goku's case to defeat Frieza. While physical change is not too drastic, the power output increase is colossal; the form is said to originally multiply the Saiyan's power by fifty times its normal amount, though it can be inferred that the multiplier decreased somewhat as new Super Saiyan levels were introduced. This was made evident by Kibito's inability to even hold the Z Sword (which Gohan in his base form could, and Goku without practice) whilst being far superior to Frieza, normal-form Goku being nearly even with Yakon, an opponent whose power was more than a fourth of Goku's Full-Power Super Saiyan level, amongst other things such as base Future Trunks knocking Imperfect Cell out of West City with a simple kiai. Despite this possible decrease in power augmentation brought on by this form, it is still shown to make the user several times stronger (and much more so in sub-forms such as Ascended Super Saiyan, Ultra Super Saiyan, and Full-Power Super Saiyan).

The most noticeable change is that the Saiyan's hair becomes golden in color and seems to stand on end, giving it a rising, flame-like appearance. This applies to all of the Saiyan's hair, including scalp hair, eyebrows, and (as it was revealed in GT) the fur on their tails and as Golden Great Apes. Natural eye color temporarily changes to a greenish-blue, muscle tone becomes more defined, and the skin tone (and clothing) becomes lighter mainly due to the energy and light output of the golden aura. As the natural floodgates of the body are opened with the transformation, excess energy is radiated from the body in the form of a pulsing, flame-like aura. There is also a marked personality alteration, where the Saiyan becomes unusually aggressive and more prone to acting on impulse. The first character to achieve the Super Saiyan transformation in the series, is Goku, in the midst of engaging Frieza.

The Super Saiyan transformation also has an interesting, unique effect on Goku's family. In addition to its normal effects: the way their eyes are drawn changes slightly. Normally, the outline around the eye is not fully drawn (it circles around about 3/4 of the way the eyeball). When in Super Saiyan, their eyes are fully surrounded by an outline (the same way that all villains are drawn; this is mainly due to Akira Toriyama wanting to show the anger and hatred that must be present for a Super Saiyan transformation). [2]

It was theorized in the film Super Android 13! that these Super Saiyan transformations prevented Goku from performing his Spirit Bomb technique. One must be pure of heart to perform the technique, and as a Super Saiyan, Goku's heart is full of rage, although not necessarily contaminated by evil. In the film, when Goku becomes a Super Saiyan after gathering power for his Spirit Bomb, he loses control of the energy and instead absorbs it into his own body. During the Kid Buu Saga, Goku assumes the transformation only after successfully creating and throwing the Spirit Bomb, although since this took place after he mastered the Super Saiyan form during the Cell Games Saga, it could just be that anger no longer filled his heart when he transformed.
[edit] Usage and power
Super Saiyan Goku battles Frieza in his 100% form.

The Super Saiyan form was first achieved by Goku after witnessing his best friend Krillin's death at the hands of Frieza. In this form, Goku's power grossly outclasses the evil tyrant's, a feat made more impressive by the fact that, prior to the transformation, Goku was no match for him, even with the Kaio-ken multiplying his power 20-fold. In order to combat Goku's sudden burst of strength and power, Frieza released all natural bodily inhibitions and utilized 100% of his power, only half of which he used to stop Goku's Kaio-ken x20 Kamehameha attack. Though he seemed to gain the upper hand while Goku holds back, he loses faith when he realizes that his attacks are no longer debilitating, with Goku merely shrugging off his most forceful blows. This was evidently because in his 100% final state, Frieza had gained power and speed, but also gained increased energy consumption to the point where his damaged body could no longer handle the amount of power he was controlling.

Two years following the titanic battle on Namek, Future Trunks would later arrive from the future along with the ability to transform, much to the astonishment of Vegeta and other present company, and dispose of the synthetically restored Frieza, and his father, King Cold with great ease (even taking Cold's full-force sword swipe to the palm without injury).
Vegeta in his Super Saiyan form, preparing to battle against Android 18.

Some time later, Vegeta also achieves the Super Saiyan transformation, mainly due to his belief that he had pushed himself to his utmost limits without actually transforming. By his own admission, it was anger at himself that triggered the intense emotion required to transform. He also noted, that he too possessed a pure heart, only one of pure evil as opposed to Goku's good, although Vegeta was not actually fully evil at the time. With this new power under his belt, Vegeta confronts and overcomes Android 19 and Dr. Gero, blithely killing #19 with the powerful Big Bang Attack. However, when the true Androids of Future Trunks' grim prediction, Android 17 and 18, arrive, they easily defeat both Vegeta and Future Trunks' Super Saiyan forms, Trunks in particular being felled in a single blow from #17, as opposed to the trained Vegeta who withstood a much longer and abashing beating, signifying his superior strength. This power is noted by Kami as he brings up the topic of how Vegeta is now more powerful than Trunks, who "killed Frieza and his father in an instant."

The limits of the Super Saiyan transformation were pushed even further with the introduction of Cell. With the basic Super Saiyan form now unable to combat the power of the Androids, Goku advises training in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber because he believes that here is a way to ascend past the normal limitations of an untrained Super Saiyan, and in doing so would make them strong enough to take down the Androids. By the time Cell had reached his Perfect Form after absorbing both the Androids, Vegeta, Future Trunks, Goku, and Gohan had all spent time in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, advancing to new Super Saiyan forms. The Super Saiyan's standard output of power would be outclassed by the Ascended and Ultra Super Saiyan stages. Unlike Vegeta and Future Trunks who make use of these stages (which either consumes one's energy rapidly and produce an increasingly higher level of strain, or reduce the Saiyan's speed to nil, with the latter doing both), Goku and Gohan work to perfect the initial transformation after deciding that it was the best form to use overall, prompting their transition into Full-Power Super Saiyan, the concept of making the Super Saiyan form no different in energy output and strain than the basic form of the user's body. The initial transformation and its advanced grades are later rendered obsolete by the introduction of a far more powerful level, Super Saiyan 2 (which is the form used by Gohan to defeat Cell), followed by Goku's introduction of Super Saiyan 3 during the Majin Buu Saga, and finally, Super Saiyan 4, introduced during Dragon Ball GT.
Goten and Trunks as Super Saiyans.

Goten and Trunks, sons of Goku and Vegeta respectively, attain the ability to transform at a remarkably young age, again to widespread surprise from the main cast. (Goten, who was about a year younger than Trunks' age of eight, stated that his transformation was so long ago that he was unable even remember it occurring.) Though their reasons for so easily transforming are never officially stated, the common theory is that it could have been the DNA inherited from their fathers' ability to transform already during their conception, supported by the fact that it took Gohan, who was also a child when he made his transformation, unbearable hardship to achieve (Gohan was born prior to the start of Dragon Ball Z, thus before his father's transformation). Their fusion form, Gotenks, seen late in Dragon Ball Z, easily gained the ability to transform into all three levels of Super Saiyan in the series within no more than a half-hour of training in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber (although he has only ever been seen assuming the first and third forms, since he bypassed the second form to ascend to the third level), with the combined energies of Goten and Trunks balancing out the high ki consumption of the final transformation. In Future Trunks case, he would have been conceived in the Alternate Timeline under very similar circumstances, although it is possible he was not conceived after Future Vegeta became a Super Saiyan, as the alternate counterparts transformation was never shown. However, despite a younger Future Trunks being weaker than his child alternate counterpart, he was still able to transform at the age of 14 (making him either the youngest or second youngest Super Saiyan in the alternate timeline, depending on when Future Gohan transformed), although he was considerably weaker due to lack of training.
Future Gohan as a Super Saiyan.

In the television special The History of Trunks and within the manga, Future Gohan is shown to have gained the Super Saiyan transformation long ago, most likely after witnessing the Z Fighters being slaughtered by the Androids. Therefor, Future Gohan may have assumed his transformation before his present timeline counterpart (by technically a matter of days), although he was far weaker because he was never trained by his father in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, and never mastered the Super Saiyan form. After he is killed, we see Future Trunks transform for the first time (only in the anime, for Trunks seemed to already have attained the transformation rather recently in the original manga), thus showing his original transformation.

In the last episode of Dragon Ball GT, Goku and Vegeta's descendants, Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr., are shown to be able to transform into Super Saiyans from a young age, as well. Goku Jr.'s first transformation in particular was shown in the Dragon Ball GT special, A Hero's Legacy, aired at around the time that episode 40 was broadcast. This heavily contradicts the Daizenshuu's explanation that Pan could not transform due to the minuscule percentage of Saiyan blood in her, as being a grandson of the already-1/4 Saiyan Pan would reduce his to no more than one sixteenth, making him almost completely human.
edit Movie appearances
Super Saiyan Goku delivers a heavy punch to Cooler.

Super Saiyan made its first movie debut in the film Dragon Ball Z: Cooler's Revenge, Goku uses his Super Saiyan power to defeat Cooler, Frieza's older and stronger brother, thus finishing off the family.

The Super Saiyan form is also used in the next two films Dragon Ball Z: The Return of Cooler by Goku and Vegeta to combat and finally kill Cooler, and in the film Dragon Ball Z: Super Android 13! by Goku, Vegeta, and Future Trunks to take down Android 14, Android 15, and Android 13.

In the next film Dragon Ball Z: Brolly - The Legendary Super Saiyan, the Saiyan Brolly is also shown to harness the original Super Saiyan transformation, which is what he uses to battle Goku for a few moments when attacking him in the dead of night. He also uses it against Goten and Trunks in Brolly: Second Coming, until he was forced to unveil his Legendary Super Saiyan form once again when fighting Gohan in his Super Saiyan 2 form.

At this point, the movies move into a time period when the original Super Saiyan form has since been outclassed by the more powerful variants, the only users of the basic transformation seen from this point on are Goten, Trunks, and their fusion of Gotenks.
edit Premature and advanced levels
Super Saiyans that appeared in the original manga series.

In Dragon Ball Z, the possibility of a power greater than that of a Super Saiyan is first theorized in the episode "Laboratory Basement", when Krillin and Future Trunks contemplate how Vegeta plans on retaining his dominance in power among the Z Fighters. The first of these new heights in power is the Ascended Super Saiyan stage obtained by Vegeta, Future Trunks and later, Goku. This technique (as well as the Ultra Super Saiyan technique that follows) is essentially a method of enhancing the abilities of a Super Saiyan, rather than a complete departure from it in favor of newer and more unique power. It is not until the Cell Games that this uncharted level of power makes its debut, in the form of Super Saiyan 2. Saiyan characters continue pushing their limits during the series, ultimately discovering a third, and in anime incarnations, fourth level of Super Saiyan. Two exclusive Super Saiyan stages are also featured in the Dragon Ball films.

There are eight variations of the Super Saiyan form, including the standard form itself. The following is a summarized list of the standard, premature, and advanced levels of the Super Saiyan transformation.

* False Super Saiyan, a pseudo-Super Saiyan form resembling a glorified Kaio-ken, with a orange-yellowish surge of aura. Appeared in Lord Slug.
* Super Saiyan, the standard Super Saiyan transformation.
* Ascended Super Saiyan, an advancement in the power of the original Super Saiyan state.
* Ultra Super Saiyan, an even stronger advancement in the power of the original Super Saiyan state.
* Full-Power Super Saiyan, the state of mental and physical perfection of the Super Saiyan transformation itself, rather than an advanced stage.
* Legendary Super Saiyan, a level of Super Saiyan which magnifies its user's strength capacity, without drawbacks. Brolly is the only known user of this Super Saiyan variant, and did not appear in the manga.
* Super Saiyan 2, the second Super Saiyan transformation.
* Super Saiyan 3, the third (and final in the manga) Super Saiyan transformation.
* Super Saiyan 4, the last, quintessential Super Saiyan transformation. Appeared only in Dragon Ball GT.

brendon View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

if you remember carefully during the time where Goku and Gohan were out of the time chamber they had full control over the Super Saiyan transformation no rage in there heart at all and Goku when he launched a Spirit Bomb at Buu was too worn out to go Super Saiyan but got his power back by porunga so then he turned Super Saiyan and made the power of the Spirit Bomb stronger then finished kid Buu off

Konan View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

I'm the legendary superposter Very Happy

Zielan KoRnified View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

It's obvious that it's Nappa :!

broly3110 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

I think the answer is pretty obvious

najeeb My Sir View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

no it's not Brolly

broly3110 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

Yes it is now stop with pointless arguments,you're "a Legendary Super Saiyan has infinite energy" argument is flawed,it doesn't have anything to do with surpassing the enemy it just means that his KI keeps on rising which they showed in the 1st Brolly movie when he did that attack in which he kept on throwing ki blasts.

If that is really the case then why didn't Goku just rise his power level up to kick Vegeta's buttocks in 1 second?Why didn't he do that on Freeza?Why didn't he do that on Buu?

Laguna|DaGGeR View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

broly3110 wrote : Yes it is now stop with pointless arguments,you're in "Legendary Super Saiyan has infinite energy" argument is flawed,it means that his KI keeps on rising which they showed in the 1st Brolly movie when he did that attack in which he kept on throwing ki blasts,if that is really the case then why didn't Goku just rise his power level up to kick Vegeta's buttocks in 1 second?Why didn't he do that on Freeza?Why didn't he do that on Buu?

I think Brolly was a teen or kid already a Super Saiyan so I guess he was the first Super Saiyan in dragonball but its only a movie it has nothing to do with the series I mean not correctly

broly3110 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

Yep,he survived a planet blowing up when he was a phucking baby!

Laguna|DaGGeR View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

broly3110 wrote : Yep,he survived a planet blowing up when he was a phucking baby!

gokus baby power level: 1

Brolly power level: bunches and bunches

JadenKorn Totally Explicit View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

Even when he was a baby, he was born with a powerlevel of 10000. At that point, both Bardock and King Vegeta had almost the powerlevel of 10000. In the flashback, Brolly did transformed into a his final form when he was a teen, giving the fact that he might've transformed as one even when he was a baby, of course, if he would've developed full conscience and/or had a strong motivation/reason to do so.

broly3110 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

I always thought that he got crazy either from his power or from the device thing,although in the movie when he was still under control he talked normal in his normal form.

Can you imagine a baby being as strong as an adult in our world?If you saw something like that you would go "What the phucking heck?" ,that's what King Vegeta and all the other Saiyans felt.

JadenKorn Totally Explicit View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

That might be true, but as discussed before, the tremendous power level increase is normal to say the least. However, Brolly has the ability to have his powerlevel growing even during battles. The first one is tied to the whole Saiyan race, as in a generic trait, but the other one is tied to Brolly's own ability, as in the Legendary Super Saiyan, which is a totally new asset to the Saiyan race.

Konan View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

The name of the movie is: the legendary Super Saiyan, and its bout Brolly not Goku, so I think the answer is still: Brolly!

ESFER25 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

How can we consider legendary a movie character? As Zielan said, it's Nappa >.>

broly3110 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

ESFER25 wrote : How can we consider legendary a movie character? As Zielan said, it's Nappa >.>



You know what ESFER?You can go here http://www.google.com/ and search,I'm not you're bambi or go an love yourself!one!11!!

ESFER25 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

*intense laughter*

medoxas View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Tuesday, August 03, 2010

Zielan wrote : It's obvious that it's Nappa :!


*rolling on floor laughing* Very Happy

brendon View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

it's not Nappa it's ghost Nappa everyon knows that

Zielan KoRnified View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

Nappa was first to achieve the Legendary Super Saiyan! Brolly was his fan >.>



Screenshot from Dragon Ball Z movie 22: True Nappa

najeeb My Sir View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

loving leaping lizard if Brolly was the true Super Saiyan then why did he let Goku defeat I'm he should ave just increased the power , I pretty much tink the title of the movie was for Goku also , that movie doesn't count ,and surviving a planet blast ? did you forget kingcold said "how could frieza not survive tis pitefull blast so technically surviving a planet blast is a childs play for migty people , also Goku"s born power level was not that of a low level , he was 2000 at birth and radist was 1200 as a adult , but because Goku didn't know who he is also he lost his tail , his pwoer level was 440 at Saiyan saga

Gerrard95 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

*laughing out loud* when he's born Bardock said gokus powerlevel is nothing special so I don't think he is got that much.2000 Shocked
and Nappa got 3 eyebrown ? Surprised

ESFER25 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

Goku's power level was 2 >.>

Gerrard95 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

ESFER25 wrote : Goku's power level was 2 >.>



hmm first I though it was 10 and 2 is okay too but 2000 is...just too much

ESFER25 View user's profile Send private message

Reply with quote Wednesday, August 04, 2010

Gerrard95 wrote :

ESFER25 wrote : Goku's power level was 2 >.>



hmm first I though it was 10 and 2 is okay too but 2000 is...just too much



Well, it depends of the dub, but it was wayyyy smaller than 50 *intense laughter*

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